flashing ticker
To interact with this page you must login.      Signup

Is the world fair?
spacer
categorysociety
typeunderstand
tynamite
tynamite's avatar Why would you ask this question, considering that the world could be somehow be fair?

If you watch the news and hear about someone being murdered, that does not make the world unfair. A minority of people murdering cannot make a world unfair. What makes the world unfair, is that it runs on a system that can never be perfect, of which not everyone can be rich, or have a good job.

Under a capitalist system people are in a pyramid working for the person above them, and the wealth goes up the higher up the pyramid.

capitalist pyramid

The West believes that capitalism is fair, because it means that the power in the world is distributed, and that people can run their own businesses.

Marxists believe that capitalism is unfair because it is ruled by "elite class exploiters," or bourgeoisie in French. They believe that in order for the world to be fair, everyone must be equal, so everyone earns the same wage and every business is run by the state; this is called communism.

Under communism there is no democracy. I was communicating on MSN with someone who once lived under communist rule in Romania, and he said that over there everyone had the same sized house, and that the only people who were allowed to leave the country were sports people under special circumstances. I asked him if everyone gets paid the same wage, what incentive is there for people to become teachers and doctors? He told me that they got paid slightly more.

dog wanting childrens food

The little boy and girl in the picture are communists as they own the food and they get to say how much is shared out to the dog. In a capitalist society, the dog would have worked for his food rather than to have all the food seized under the kids's control and shared how they feel to please.

Also note that communism is strongly linked to there being no democracy as 1 person holds all the power, all the cards and others have little say.

As you can tell by the images, I believe in capitalism.

Under a capitalist system, there are only a few spaces for people to be rich. Someone has to be the cleaner, the checkout assistant, the receptionist. That's why sometimes governments make it harder for people to get into university or make school exams harder, because too many people are getting degrees, so they are becoming worthless.

Under a communist system, there isn't really an incentive to do a skilled jobs. The good thing is that communism is an exceptional way of making people equal in society, and that it gives people the jobs that they want to do; but that comes at a price, the ability to be rich or run a business and have some control over what goes on in the country, because under communism there is no democracy.

You either choose to be communist and restrict people's freedom, or become capitalist and introduce a working class. Both systems are flawed, and both systems try to solve a problem that can never be solved. People have tried to fix the system by introducing welfare into a capitalist system, so people aren't destitute, and other such things.

On another note, capitalist societies reward people for their hard work, whereas communist people stop people from getting rich. There's a reason why the The United Kingdom and USA countries have companies like Microsoft (company) and Cadbury; and there's a reason why China's and Iran's economies are based on fraudulent or prohibited practises, such as mafia drugs or counterfeit goods. I can't see Chinese pharmaceutical or computer science companies in a country where patents are nonexistent. Those countries work by reducing competition by protecting companies from threats. Have you ever seen Apple (company) or PepsiCo (company) ask their government to protect them from their more successful rival companies?

The system is flawed, and can never be fixed. We will never have world peace or mass prosperity in this world because of the lack of prosperity or freedom that these systems cause. And that is why the world is unfair. The system is flawed, and can never be fixed.

report this post permalink
tynamite
tynamite's avatar

Erik

One objection to: "Under a capitalist system, there are only a few spaces for people to be rich."

That's false. That presumes that Capitalism is a Zero-Sum Game, which it is not. See Is capitalism a zero-sum game? Does the rich getting richer somehow mean that the poor get poorer? and How is wealth created?
report this post permalink
tynamite
tynamite's avatar

Me

You should have used the term well off instead of rich.

Under a capitalist system, many people can be well off by implementing schemes to increase social mobility. Examples of such are public healthcare, patents, and free education. They narrow the rich and poor divide, allowing many people to be able to luxuries.

However not everyone can be rich, as there are only enough spaces in the world for millionaires. Not everyone can be a millionaire in a capitalist system, but everyone can afford a house and an iPad in their house.
report this post permalink
tynamite
tynamite's avatar

Bruce

I've never heard such a biased argument with no consideration for in-between positions!
report this post permalink
tynamite
tynamite's avatar

Me

Could you please tell me what an in-between position is?
report this post permalink
tynamite
tynamite's avatar

Mark

Kinda pessimistic wouldn't you say? Then why go on living if you feel the system can never be fixed. Don't get me wrong, I too feel we need a new system, but it will be capitalism that will stand in anyones way to make change. Look at Libya, and Syria right now, look at Saudi Arabia, look at Latin America. There is a wide spectrum of possibilities all over the world for change, but the only change will come when people chose to change, no sooner no later! Capitalism and globalization continue to fail the world and dominate the poorest and least educated by filling dreams with hot air and tying weights to the feet of innocence and magnetizing the moral compasses of the world's purest minds, our children. Our political systems in the world "are" broken, not because they are inhumane, but because they are based on principles over people, it will be only when all people choose (and are not forced by law) to look at all other human beings regardless of age, race, religion, wealth, mental disposition and academic accomplishment, and truly see that we are all the same, that each of us can chose the peace of the world, first in our own lives to exemplify that which we know to be true in our common heart!
report this post permalink
tynamite
tynamite's avatar

Me

I do not agree that I've been pessimistic.You have a lot to say for yourself. Can you please tell me what you propose a perfect economic system for the world would be.
report this post permalink
tynamite
tynamite's avatar

Mark

Well Adisa you say "...the world is unfair.. The system is flawed and can never be fixed". I am pretty certain that was not the first paragraph of the "Optimist Handbook". (insert smile here)

Obviously, your request is quite a challenge, and while it may seem almost impossible to describe in such a short space, I will give it a good go anyway for entertainment's sake!

As a founding base, ethics and morals that demonstrate kindness, respect, and understanding would be the guiding premise. Without these traits of human endeavor and communication, no person should be allowed to amass economic wealth.

No person should be without healthy food, clean water, adequate clothing and housing, nor access to basic education and appropriate healthcare. Absolutely no one! This can easily be accomplished throughout the world and should be but is not this is the greatest shame of humanity!

As for politics, there should be none! People need to be taught not only about their rights but also about their responsibilities. Governments like capitalism are self propagating self benefiting mechanisms, that with technology and honest communication can be eliminated. Think about it, most children would never choose to "go to war", hatred and division are learned! It is also quite astonishing that the great majority of aging people (people in their 80's and 90"s) also see war as a senseless waste of time and life. People can responsibly stand up for their rights, but only governments go to war~!

As for welfare, I feel it is a great system born out of the principles stated above. Is it abused? Most certainly, and it should be fixed to bring benefit to those who truly deserve it!
report this post permalink
tynamite
tynamite's avatar

Mark

Oh, and if we have to have governments and pay taxes. The people should decide where their tax money goes and how it is used. I firmly believe that would end much abuse.
report this post permalink
tynamite
tynamite's avatar

Me

There was a documentary about some rich person who brought a remote island, and setup a fair communist place with solar panels, free internet, sustainable living with enough food for everyone. I've forgot what it's called.

There's also a place in a country run by marxist rebels who disobey the government and run the place with their own laws. There is no crime, and nobody there is allowed to sell their house.

==============

In response to what you said which I disagree with...

1.
(we should choose where our taxes go and how it's used to end abuse)ould we have any real democracy, if the House of Parliament didn't have MPs who were elected, but instead was an open system for the general public to walk in and vote, like a court. And there were no elections? You just walked in whenever you felt like it and voted? Would that be more fair?

2.
No person should amount to massive wealth = communism

3.
There should be no politics --> Look at my answer for this question. It talks about mafia corruption.
What would happen if everything in this world was free?
report this post permalink
What's an assertion, and what should I type in?

Compesh is a question and answer (and debate) website, so before you make a debate, you better learn what an assertion is. I suppose you already know what a question is, and that you've typed it in the box. ;)

An assertion, is basically a statement you can make, that is either true or false.

Richer people have better health.

The question for that would be, Do richer people have better health?

And don't forget to make your assertion, match your question.

Compesh logo